Mysterious survey sync problem and the need to get survey data off phones manually

Hello,

I have encountered a serious problem. We are currently running a survey on
businesses in Cape Town’s informal settlements with about 10 field workers
and have run into the following problem (which we need resolved in order
for the survey users to maintain any degree of confidence in the system)
and that has led us to ask if the devices have any way of backing up the
fill out surveys?

We deployed 8 devices -each device being logged in to with one of 14 user
names- in the field (using the “sustainablelivelihoods” project) where they
have collected about 60 to 70 detailed surveys so far over 2 days (8th and
9th June 2015). We tested the system numerous times before it was sent out
into the field with it working perfectly.

Once in the field however no one was able to sync with the server to save
and upload completed surveys. They were able to login with no problems but
as soon as they tried to sync their devices Commcare refused to upload
completed surveys and gave no error message. The system seems to work when
I login using only the fime1, fime2, or fime3 user names but not when using
other more recently used ones. A small message in the top left of the
screen comes up saying it is syncing or uploading to the cloud but this is
not the case as the main sync button still indicates that all surveys had
not been synced. This is the first mysterious -but some what less
problematic- problem.

We found that if we logged out then logged in again into the devices using
one of the 3 afor mentioned user names then the devices appear to sync.
However -and this is the second and very serious problem- none of the 60
odd previously collected surveys have been uploaded to the backend at
CommcareHQ whilst the orginally saved forms have now been removed from each
of the devices with no apparent way to get them back. The only data we can
find on CommcareHQ are the test surveys we did before and after this
problem occurred.

We need answers to the following questions urgently:

  1. Is there a way for us to retrieve any of our 60-70 previously
    collected surveys from the devices now that they have apparently 'synced’
    with the cloud?
  2. Is there a way for us to find any of the same 60-70 surveys on the
    cloud?
  3. Is there a way to manually get survey data directly off the devices?
    (if this was possible we would not have any of these problems)
  4. Does the Commcare app save or create any backup of surveys on devices
    after it has been synced?
  5. How can we be sure that this system will work properly in the field
    when we deploy next time? (which will hopefully be very soon, or as soon
    as we have sorted this problem out)

I have logged two reports about this already using the front end of the app
on the devices (one send today and another one sent yesterday)

I have been using Commcare for 3 years now and this is the first time I
have ever seen anything like this and it is coursing our partners a lot
of anxiety.

Thanks,

Douglas.

Hey Douglas,

Yikes! This sounds highly unexpected and hopefully everything is still
recoverable. I have a few quick questions/comments.

Hello,

I have encountered a serious problem. We are currently running a survey
on businesses in Cape Town’s informal settlements with about 10 field
workers and have run into the following problem (which we need resolved in
order for the survey users to maintain any degree of confidence in the
system) and that has led us to ask if the devices have any way of backing
up the fill out surveys?

We deployed 8 devices -each device being logged in to with one of 14 user
names- in the field (using the “sustainablelivelihoods” project) where they
have collected about 60 to 70 detailed surveys so far over 2 days (8th and
9th June 2015). We tested the system numerous times before it was sent out
into the field with it working perfectly.

Once in the field however no one was able to sync with the server to save
and upload completed surveys. They were able to login with no problems but
as soon as they tried to sync their devices Commcare refused to upload
completed surveys and gave no error message. The system seems to work when
I login using only the fime1, fime2, or fime3 user names but not when using
other more recently used ones. A small message in the top left of the
screen comes up saying it is syncing or uploading to the cloud but this is
not the case as the main sync button still indicates that all surveys had
not been synced. This is the first mysterious -but some what less
problematic- problem.

We found that if we logged out then logged in again into the devices using
one of the 3 afor mentioned user names then the devices appear to sync.
However -and this is the second and very serious problem- none of the 60
odd previously collected surveys have been uploaded to the backend at
CommcareHQ whilst the orginally saved forms have now been removed from each
of the devices with no apparent way to get them back. The only data we can
find on CommcareHQ are the test surveys we did before and after this
problem occurred.

User data on the mobile is sandboxed by account. So I wouldn’t expect that
logging in as a different user and syncing would submit the other user’s
forms. Have you tried logging back in as the original user and seeing if
the saved forms are there? I would not expect any data loss unless you
manually reinstalled the application, or cleared user data intentionally.

We need answers to the following questions urgently:

  1. Is there a way for us to retrieve any of our 60-70 previously
    collected surveys from the devices now that they have apparently 'synced’
    with the cloud?

Hopefully, see above.

  1. Is there a way for us to find any of the same 60-70 surveys on the
    cloud?

If the forms never submitted they won’t show up on HQ.

  1. Is there a way to manually get survey data directly off the
    devices? (if this was possible we would not have any of these problems)

There definitely should be - this seems to be the root problem. Are you
using multimedia/image capture in your forms? If so you may be encountering
a known bug that affects submissions, and we can suggest a workaround.

  1. Does the Commcare app save or create any backup of surveys on
    devices after it has been synced?

After it has synced, no, however it should never delete anything until the
server successfully acknowledges that it receives it, and the server should
never lose anything.

  1. How can we be sure that this system will work properly in the field
    when we deploy next time? (which will hopefully be very soon, or as soon
    as we have sorted this problem out)

We need to get to the root cause of the submission issue, and then
(hopefully) everything should be fine.

I have logged two reports about this already using the front end of the
app on the devices (one send today and another one sent yesterday)

If my suggestions above don’t work out please report an issue on HQ and our
team can continue investigating there.

best,
Cory

··· On Wed, Jun 10, 2015 at 6:52 AM, Douglas Ian Scott < douglas.i.scott@gmail.com> wrote:

I have been using Commcare for 3 years now and this is the first time I
have ever seen anything like this and it is coursing our partners a lot
of anxiety.

Thanks,

Douglas.


You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
"commcare-users" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
email to commcare-users+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

Hi Cory,

Good to know that the survey data, in some way, stays on the device even
after syncing (or not syncing). In answer to your question about
photographs, yes the survey does indeed ask for participants to take a
photograph as part of the surveys.

Thanks for the quick response. We have found the ‘lost’ survey forms
following your suggestion that they are still stored on the devices within
the respective user name’s sandbox. Thanks for pointing this out.

However we still have the problem of some user login being able to sync
with the server and others not being able to sync with the survey. I am
using a Community plan which allows for 50 users and only have 14
registered in this project so I don’t think that should have anything to do
with it?

Cheers,

Douglas.

··· On Wednesday, 10 June 2015 13:08:46 UTC+2, Cory Zue wrote: > > Hey Douglas, > > Yikes! This sounds highly unexpected and hopefully everything is still > recoverable. I have a few quick questions/comments. > > On Wed, Jun 10, 2015 at 6:52 AM, Douglas Ian Scott <douglas...@gmail.com > wrote: > >> Hello, >> >> I have encountered a serious problem. We are currently running a survey >> on businesses in Cape Town's informal settlements with about 10 field >> workers and have run into the following problem (which we need resolved in >> order for the survey users to maintain any degree of confidence in the >> system) and that has led us to ask if the devices have any way of backing >> up the fill out surveys? >> >> We deployed 8 devices -each device being logged in to with one of 14 user >> names- in the field (using the "sustainablelivelihoods" project) where they >> have collected about 60 to 70 detailed surveys so far over 2 days (8th and >> 9th June 2015). We tested the system numerous times before it was sent out >> into the field with it working perfectly. >> >> Once in the field however no one was able to sync with the server to save >> and upload completed surveys. They were able to login with no problems but >> as soon as they tried to sync their devices Commcare refused to upload >> completed surveys and gave no error message. The system seems to work when >> I login using only the fime1, fime2, or fime3 user names but not when using >> other more recently used ones. A small message in the top left of the >> screen comes up saying it is syncing or uploading to the cloud but this is >> not the case as the main sync button still indicates that all surveys had >> not been synced. This is the first mysterious -but some what less >> problematic- problem. >> >> We found that if we logged out then logged in again into the devices >> using one of the 3 afor mentioned user names then the devices appear to >> sync. However -and this is the second and very serious problem- none of >> the 60 odd previously collected surveys have been uploaded to the backend >> at CommcareHQ whilst the orginally saved forms have now been removed from >> each of the devices with no apparent way to get them back. The only data >> we can find on CommcareHQ are the test surveys we did before and after this >> problem occurred. >> > > User data on the mobile is sandboxed by account. So I wouldn't expect that > logging in as a different user and syncing would submit the other user's > forms. Have you tried logging back in as the original user and seeing if > the saved forms are there? I would not expect any data loss unless you > manually reinstalled the application, or cleared user data intentionally. > > We need answers to the following questions urgently: >> >> 1. Is there a way for us to retrieve any of our 60-70 previously >> collected surveys from the devices now that they have apparently 'synced' >> with the cloud? >> >> > Hopefully, see above. > >> >> 1. Is there a way for us to find any of the same 60-70 surveys on the >> cloud? >> >> If the forms never submitted they won't show up on HQ. > >> >> 1. Is there a way to manually get survey data directly off the >> devices? (if this was possible we would not have any of these problems) >> >> There definitely should be - this seems to be the root problem. Are you > using multimedia/image capture in your forms? If so you may be encountering > a known bug that affects submissions, and we can suggest a workaround. > >> >> 1. Does the Commcare app save or create any backup of surveys on >> devices after it has been synced? >> >> After it has synced, no, however it should never delete anything until > the server successfully acknowledges that it receives it, and the server > should never lose anything. > >> >> 1. How can we be sure that this system will work properly in the >> field when we deploy next time? (which will hopefully be very soon, or as >> soon as we have sorted this problem out) >> >> We need to get to the root cause of the submission issue, and then > (hopefully) everything should be fine. > > >> I have logged two reports about this already using the front end of the >> app on the devices (one send today and another one sent yesterday) >> > > If my suggestions above don't work out please report an issue on HQ and > our team can continue investigating there. > > best, > Cory > > >> > >> I have been using Commcare for 3 years now and this is the first time I >> have ever seen anything like this and it is coursing our partners a lot >> of anxiety. >> >> Thanks, >> >> Douglas. >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "commcare-users" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to commcare-user...@googlegroups.com . >> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >> > >

Hi Cory,

A quick question. If we want to upgrade from the Community program but only
want to have a short term contract of a couple of months do you know who
the best person at Dimagi might be to talk to about that. Also would it be
possible to move/share our existing project with a new CommcareHQ
administrator user?

Cheers,

Douglas.

··· On Wednesday, 10 June 2015 14:30:59 UTC+2, Douglas Ian Scott wrote: > > Hi Cory, > > Good to know that the survey data, in some way, stays on the device even > after syncing (or not syncing). In answer to your question about > photographs, yes the survey does indeed ask for participants to take a > photograph as part of the surveys. > > Thanks for the quick response. We have found the 'lost' survey forms > following your suggestion that they are still stored on the devices within > the respective user name's sandbox. Thanks for pointing this out. > > However we still have the problem of some user login being able to sync > with the server and others not being able to sync with the survey. I am > using a Community plan which allows for 50 users and only have 14 > registered in this project so I don't think that should have anything to do > with it? > > Cheers, > > Douglas. > > On Wednesday, 10 June 2015 13:08:46 UTC+2, Cory Zue wrote: >> >> Hey Douglas, >> >> Yikes! This sounds highly unexpected and hopefully everything is still >> recoverable. I have a few quick questions/comments. >> >> On Wed, Jun 10, 2015 at 6:52 AM, Douglas Ian Scott wrote: >> >>> Hello, >>> >>> I have encountered a serious problem. We are currently running a survey >>> on businesses in Cape Town's informal settlements with about 10 field >>> workers and have run into the following problem (which we need resolved in >>> order for the survey users to maintain any degree of confidence in the >>> system) and that has led us to ask if the devices have any way of backing >>> up the fill out surveys? >>> >>> We deployed 8 devices -each device being logged in to with one of 14 >>> user names- in the field (using the "sustainablelivelihoods" project) where >>> they have collected about 60 to 70 detailed surveys so far over 2 days (8th >>> and 9th June 2015). We tested the system numerous times before it was sent >>> out into the field with it working perfectly. >>> >>> Once in the field however no one was able to sync with the server to >>> save and upload completed surveys. They were able to login with no >>> problems but as soon as they tried to sync their devices Commcare refused >>> to upload completed surveys and gave no error message. The system seems to >>> work when I login using only the fime1, fime2, or fime3 user names but not >>> when using other more recently used ones. A small message in the top left >>> of the screen comes up saying it is syncing or uploading to the cloud but >>> this is not the case as the main sync button still indicates that all >>> surveys had not been synced. This is the first mysterious -but some what >>> less problematic- problem. >>> >>> We found that if we logged out then logged in again into the devices >>> using one of the 3 afor mentioned user names then the devices appear to >>> sync. However -and this is the second and very serious problem- none of >>> the 60 odd previously collected surveys have been uploaded to the backend >>> at CommcareHQ whilst the orginally saved forms have now been removed from >>> each of the devices with no apparent way to get them back. The only data >>> we can find on CommcareHQ are the test surveys we did before and after this >>> problem occurred. >>> >> >> User data on the mobile is sandboxed by account. So I wouldn't expect >> that logging in as a different user and syncing would submit the other >> user's forms. Have you tried logging back in as the original user and >> seeing if the saved forms are there? I would not expect any data loss >> unless you manually reinstalled the application, or cleared user data >> intentionally. >> >> We need answers to the following questions urgently: >>> >>> 1. Is there a way for us to retrieve any of our 60-70 previously >>> collected surveys from the devices now that they have apparently 'synced' >>> with the cloud? >>> >>> >> Hopefully, see above. >> >>> >>> 1. Is there a way for us to find any of the same 60-70 surveys on >>> the cloud? >>> >>> If the forms never submitted they won't show up on HQ. >> >>> >>> 1. Is there a way to manually get survey data directly off the >>> devices? (if this was possible we would not have any of these problems) >>> >>> There definitely should be - this seems to be the root problem. Are you >> using multimedia/image capture in your forms? If so you may be encountering >> a known bug that affects submissions, and we can suggest a workaround. >> >>> >>> 1. Does the Commcare app save or create any backup of surveys on >>> devices after it has been synced? >>> >>> After it has synced, no, however it should never delete anything until >> the server successfully acknowledges that it receives it, and the server >> should never lose anything. >> >>> >>> 1. How can we be sure that this system will work properly in the >>> field when we deploy next time? (which will hopefully be very soon, or as >>> soon as we have sorted this problem out) >>> >>> We need to get to the root cause of the submission issue, and then >> (hopefully) everything should be fine. >> >> >>> I have logged two reports about this already using the front end of the >>> app on the devices (one send today and another one sent yesterday) >>> >> >> If my suggestions above don't work out please report an issue on HQ and >> our team can continue investigating there. >> >> best, >> Cory >> >> >>> >> >>> I have been using Commcare for 3 years now and this is the first time I >>> have ever seen anything like this and it is coursing our partners a lot >>> of anxiety. >>> >>> Thanks, >>> >>> Douglas. >>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> Groups "commcare-users" group. >>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>> an email to commcare-user...@googlegroups.com. >>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>> >> >>

Hello,

I now think it is far more likely to have to do with the photographs. When
I do a survey without a photograph it syncs well. When I do the same
survey but with a photograph add to it then it will not sync.

Do you know if there is a fix for the photograph bug? Could you also
please tell me a bit more about this bug so we can work around it in the
future?

Thanks,

Douglas.

··· On Wednesday, 10 June 2015 14:34:04 UTC+2, Douglas Ian Scott wrote: > > Hi Cory, > > A quick question. If we want to upgrade from the Community program but > only want to have a short term contract of a couple of months do you know > who the best person at Dimagi might be to talk to about that. Also would > it be possible to move/share our existing project with a new CommcareHQ > administrator user? > > Cheers, > > Douglas. > > On Wednesday, 10 June 2015 14:30:59 UTC+2, Douglas Ian Scott wrote: >> >> Hi Cory, >> >> Good to know that the survey data, in some way, stays on the device even >> after syncing (or not syncing). In answer to your question about >> photographs, yes the survey does indeed ask for participants to take a >> photograph as part of the surveys. >> >> Thanks for the quick response. We have found the 'lost' survey forms >> following your suggestion that they are still stored on the devices within >> the respective user name's sandbox. Thanks for pointing this out. >> >> However we still have the problem of some user login being able to sync >> with the server and others not being able to sync with the survey. I am >> using a Community plan which allows for 50 users and only have 14 >> registered in this project so I don't think that should have anything to do >> with it? >> >> Cheers, >> >> Douglas. >> >> On Wednesday, 10 June 2015 13:08:46 UTC+2, Cory Zue wrote: >>> >>> Hey Douglas, >>> >>> Yikes! This sounds highly unexpected and hopefully everything is still >>> recoverable. I have a few quick questions/comments. >>> >>> On Wed, Jun 10, 2015 at 6:52 AM, Douglas Ian Scott >> >>>> Hello, >>>> >>>> I have encountered a serious problem. We are currently running a >>>> survey on businesses in Cape Town's informal settlements with about 10 >>>> field workers and have run into the following problem (which we need >>>> resolved in order for the survey users to maintain any degree of confidence >>>> in the system) and that has led us to ask if the devices have any way of >>>> backing up the fill out surveys? >>>> >>>> We deployed 8 devices -each device being logged in to with one of 14 >>>> user names- in the field (using the "sustainablelivelihoods" project) where >>>> they have collected about 60 to 70 detailed surveys so far over 2 days (8th >>>> and 9th June 2015). We tested the system numerous times before it was sent >>>> out into the field with it working perfectly. >>>> >>>> Once in the field however no one was able to sync with the server to >>>> save and upload completed surveys. They were able to login with no >>>> problems but as soon as they tried to sync their devices Commcare refused >>>> to upload completed surveys and gave no error message. The system seems to >>>> work when I login using only the fime1, fime2, or fime3 user names but not >>>> when using other more recently used ones. A small message in the top left >>>> of the screen comes up saying it is syncing or uploading to the cloud but >>>> this is not the case as the main sync button still indicates that all >>>> surveys had not been synced. This is the first mysterious -but some what >>>> less problematic- problem. >>>> >>>> We found that if we logged out then logged in again into the devices >>>> using one of the 3 afor mentioned user names then the devices appear to >>>> sync. However -and this is the second and very serious problem- none of >>>> the 60 odd previously collected surveys have been uploaded to the backend >>>> at CommcareHQ whilst the orginally saved forms have now been removed from >>>> each of the devices with no apparent way to get them back. The only data >>>> we can find on CommcareHQ are the test surveys we did before and after this >>>> problem occurred. >>>> >>> >>> User data on the mobile is sandboxed by account. So I wouldn't expect >>> that logging in as a different user and syncing would submit the other >>> user's forms. Have you tried logging back in as the original user and >>> seeing if the saved forms are there? I would not expect any data loss >>> unless you manually reinstalled the application, or cleared user data >>> intentionally. >>> >>> We need answers to the following questions urgently: >>>> >>>> 1. Is there a way for us to retrieve any of our 60-70 previously >>>> collected surveys from the devices now that they have apparently 'synced' >>>> with the cloud? >>>> >>>> >>> Hopefully, see above. >>> >>>> >>>> 1. Is there a way for us to find any of the same 60-70 surveys on >>>> the cloud? >>>> >>>> If the forms never submitted they won't show up on HQ. >>> >>>> >>>> 1. Is there a way to manually get survey data directly off the >>>> devices? (if this was possible we would not have any of these problems) >>>> >>>> There definitely should be - this seems to be the root problem. Are you >>> using multimedia/image capture in your forms? If so you may be encountering >>> a known bug that affects submissions, and we can suggest a workaround. >>> >>>> >>>> 1. Does the Commcare app save or create any backup of surveys on >>>> devices after it has been synced? >>>> >>>> After it has synced, no, however it should never delete anything until >>> the server successfully acknowledges that it receives it, and the server >>> should never lose anything. >>> >>>> >>>> 1. How can we be sure that this system will work properly in the >>>> field when we deploy next time? (which will hopefully be very soon, or as >>>> soon as we have sorted this problem out) >>>> >>>> We need to get to the root cause of the submission issue, and then >>> (hopefully) everything should be fine. >>> >>> >>>> I have logged two reports about this already using the front end of the >>>> app on the devices (one send today and another one sent yesterday) >>>> >>> >>> If my suggestions above don't work out please report an issue on HQ and >>> our team can continue investigating there. >>> >>> best, >>> Cory >>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> I have been using Commcare for 3 years now and this is the first time I >>>> have ever seen anything like this and it is coursing our partners a lot >>>> of anxiety. >>>> >>>> Thanks, >>>> >>>> Douglas. >>>> >>>> -- >>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>> Groups "commcare-users" group. >>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>>> an email to commcare-user...@googlegroups.com. >>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>>> >>> >>>

Hey Douglas,

Cool, yeah it sounds like you’re experiencing a known issue with multimedia
submissions. You should be able to fix this by following the same instructions
here
https://groups.google.com/forum/#!searchin/commcare-users/secure$20submissions/commcare-users/WvNpcU1OhaU/hiIkgbrSePIJ
(pasted again).

  1. Go to your project settings --> Privacy and Security, and turn off the
    "secure submissions" setting.
  2. After changing this settings, create a new version of your application
    and deploy this version to your mobile device.

Note that disabling this setting does allow malicious users to fake data
submissions to your project. While this is likely a very low probability
scenario, it is worth noting. We are actively working on a fix so that this
workaround is no longer required.

Let us know if this doesn’t work, and we do expect to have this fixed very
shortly.

thanks,
Cory

··· On Wed, Jun 10, 2015 at 8:48 AM, Douglas Ian Scott < douglas.i.scott@gmail.com> wrote:

Hello,

I now think it is far more likely to have to do with the photographs.
When I do a survey without a photograph it syncs well. When I do the same
survey but with a photograph add to it then it will not sync.

Do you know if there is a fix for the photograph bug? Could you also
please tell me a bit more about this bug so we can work around it in the
future?

Thanks,

Douglas.

On Wednesday, 10 June 2015 14:34:04 UTC+2, Douglas Ian Scott wrote:

Hi Cory,

A quick question. If we want to upgrade from the Community program but
only want to have a short term contract of a couple of months do you know
who the best person at Dimagi might be to talk to about that. Also would
it be possible to move/share our existing project with a new CommcareHQ
administrator user?

Cheers,

Douglas.

On Wednesday, 10 June 2015 14:30:59 UTC+2, Douglas Ian Scott wrote:

Hi Cory,

Good to know that the survey data, in some way, stays on the device even
after syncing (or not syncing). In answer to your question about
photographs, yes the survey does indeed ask for participants to take a
photograph as part of the surveys.

Thanks for the quick response. We have found the ‘lost’ survey forms
following your suggestion that they are still stored on the devices within
the respective user name’s sandbox. Thanks for pointing this out.

However we still have the problem of some user login being able to sync
with the server and others not being able to sync with the survey. I am
using a Community plan which allows for 50 users and only have 14
registered in this project so I don’t think that should have anything to do
with it?

Cheers,

Douglas.

On Wednesday, 10 June 2015 13:08:46 UTC+2, Cory Zue wrote:

Hey Douglas,

Yikes! This sounds highly unexpected and hopefully everything is still
recoverable. I have a few quick questions/comments.

On Wed, Jun 10, 2015 at 6:52 AM, Douglas Ian Scott < douglas...@gmail.com> wrote:

Hello,

I have encountered a serious problem. We are currently running a
survey on businesses in Cape Town’s informal settlements with about 10
field workers and have run into the following problem (which we need
resolved in order for the survey users to maintain any degree of confidence
in the system) and that has led us to ask if the devices have any way of
backing up the fill out surveys?

We deployed 8 devices -each device being logged in to with one of 14
user names- in the field (using the “sustainablelivelihoods” project) where
they have collected about 60 to 70 detailed surveys so far over 2 days (8th
and 9th June 2015). We tested the system numerous times before it was sent
out into the field with it working perfectly.

Once in the field however no one was able to sync with the server to
save and upload completed surveys. They were able to login with no
problems but as soon as they tried to sync their devices Commcare refused
to upload completed surveys and gave no error message. The system seems to
work when I login using only the fime1, fime2, or fime3 user names but not
when using other more recently used ones. A small message in the top left
of the screen comes up saying it is syncing or uploading to the cloud but
this is not the case as the main sync button still indicates that all
surveys had not been synced. This is the first mysterious -but some what
less problematic- problem.

We found that if we logged out then logged in again into the devices
using one of the 3 afor mentioned user names then the devices appear to
sync. However -and this is the second and very serious problem- none of
the 60 odd previously collected surveys have been uploaded to the backend
at CommcareHQ whilst the orginally saved forms have now been removed from
each of the devices with no apparent way to get them back. The only data
we can find on CommcareHQ are the test surveys we did before and after this
problem occurred.

User data on the mobile is sandboxed by account. So I wouldn’t expect
that logging in as a different user and syncing would submit the other
user’s forms. Have you tried logging back in as the original user and
seeing if the saved forms are there? I would not expect any data loss
unless you manually reinstalled the application, or cleared user data
intentionally.

We need answers to the following questions urgently:

  1. Is there a way for us to retrieve any of our 60-70 previously
    collected surveys from the devices now that they have apparently 'synced’
    with the cloud?

Hopefully, see above.

  1. Is there a way for us to find any of the same 60-70 surveys on
    the cloud?

If the forms never submitted they won’t show up on HQ.

  1. Is there a way to manually get survey data directly off the
    devices? (if this was possible we would not have any of these problems)

There definitely should be - this seems to be the root problem. Are
you using multimedia/image capture in your forms? If so you may be
encountering a known bug that affects submissions, and we can suggest a
workaround.

  1. Does the Commcare app save or create any backup of surveys on
    devices after it has been synced?

After it has synced, no, however it should never delete anything until
the server successfully acknowledges that it receives it, and the server
should never lose anything.

  1. How can we be sure that this system will work properly in the
    field when we deploy next time? (which will hopefully be very soon, or as
    soon as we have sorted this problem out)

We need to get to the root cause of the submission issue, and then
(hopefully) everything should be fine.

I have logged two reports about this already using the front end of
the app on the devices (one send today and another one sent yesterday)

If my suggestions above don’t work out please report an issue on HQ and
our team can continue investigating there.

best,
Cory

I have been using Commcare for 3 years now and this is the first time
I have ever seen anything like this and it is coursing our partners a lot
of anxiety.

Thanks,

Douglas.


You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
Groups “commcare-users” group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send
an email to commcare-user...@googlegroups.com.
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Hi Cory,

Thanks for that, very helpful. I do have one other question though. How
can I sync the existing 60 or so surveys that have photographs in them and
that are on the devices. Is there a way for me to alter saved forms that
allows me to ‘unanswer’ the photograph question or otherwise remove the
photograph so the bug does not kick in and thereby allow the forms to sync
with HQ?

Thanks,

Douglas.

··· On Wednesday, 10 June 2015 15:41:16 UTC+2, Cory Zue wrote: > > Hey Douglas, > > Cool, yeah it sounds like you're experiencing a known issue with > multimedia submissions. You should be able to fix this by following the > same instructions here > > (pasted again). > > 1) Go to your project settings --> Privacy and Security, and turn off the > "secure submissions" setting. > 2) After changing this settings, create a new version of your application > and deploy this version to your mobile device. > > Note that disabling this setting does allow malicious users to fake data > submissions to your project. While this is likely a very low probability > scenario, it is worth noting. We are actively working on a fix so that this > workaround is no longer required. > > Let us know if this doesn't work, and we do expect to have this fixed very > shortly. > > thanks, > Cory > > On Wed, Jun 10, 2015 at 8:48 AM, Douglas Ian Scott <douglas...@gmail.com > wrote: > >> Hello, >> >> I now think it is far more likely to have to do with the photographs. >> When I do a survey without a photograph it syncs well. When I do the same >> survey but with a photograph add to it then it will not sync. >> >> Do you know if there is a fix for the photograph bug? Could you also >> please tell me a bit more about this bug so we can work around it in the >> future? >> >> Thanks, >> >> Douglas. >> >> >> On Wednesday, 10 June 2015 14:34:04 UTC+2, Douglas Ian Scott wrote: >>> >>> Hi Cory, >>> >>> A quick question. If we want to upgrade from the Community program but >>> only want to have a short term contract of a couple of months do you know >>> who the best person at Dimagi might be to talk to about that. Also would >>> it be possible to move/share our existing project with a new CommcareHQ >>> administrator user? >>> >>> Cheers, >>> >>> Douglas. >>> >>> On Wednesday, 10 June 2015 14:30:59 UTC+2, Douglas Ian Scott wrote: >>>> >>>> Hi Cory, >>>> >>>> Good to know that the survey data, in some way, stays on the device >>>> even after syncing (or not syncing). In answer to your question about >>>> photographs, yes the survey does indeed ask for participants to take a >>>> photograph as part of the surveys. >>>> >>>> Thanks for the quick response. We have found the 'lost' survey forms >>>> following your suggestion that they are still stored on the devices within >>>> the respective user name's sandbox. Thanks for pointing this out. >>>> >>>> However we still have the problem of some user login being able to sync >>>> with the server and others not being able to sync with the survey. I am >>>> using a Community plan which allows for 50 users and only have 14 >>>> registered in this project so I don't think that should have anything to do >>>> with it? >>>> >>>> Cheers, >>>> >>>> Douglas. >>>> >>>> On Wednesday, 10 June 2015 13:08:46 UTC+2, Cory Zue wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Hey Douglas, >>>>> >>>>> Yikes! This sounds highly unexpected and hopefully everything is still >>>>> recoverable. I have a few quick questions/comments. >>>>> >>>>> On Wed, Jun 10, 2015 at 6:52 AM, Douglas Ian Scott < douglas...@gmail.com> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Hello, >>>>>> >>>>>> I have encountered a serious problem. We are currently running a >>>>>> survey on businesses in Cape Town's informal settlements with about 10 >>>>>> field workers and have run into the following problem (which we need >>>>>> resolved in order for the survey users to maintain any degree of confidence >>>>>> in the system) and that has led us to ask if the devices have any way of >>>>>> backing up the fill out surveys? >>>>>> >>>>>> We deployed 8 devices -each device being logged in to with one of 14 >>>>>> user names- in the field (using the "sustainablelivelihoods" project) where >>>>>> they have collected about 60 to 70 detailed surveys so far over 2 days (8th >>>>>> and 9th June 2015). We tested the system numerous times before it was sent >>>>>> out into the field with it working perfectly. >>>>>> >>>>>> Once in the field however no one was able to sync with the server to >>>>>> save and upload completed surveys. They were able to login with no >>>>>> problems but as soon as they tried to sync their devices Commcare refused >>>>>> to upload completed surveys and gave no error message. The system seems to >>>>>> work when I login using only the fime1, fime2, or fime3 user names but not >>>>>> when using other more recently used ones. A small message in the top left >>>>>> of the screen comes up saying it is syncing or uploading to the cloud but >>>>>> this is not the case as the main sync button still indicates that all >>>>>> surveys had not been synced. This is the first mysterious -but some what >>>>>> less problematic- problem. >>>>>> >>>>>> We found that if we logged out then logged in again into the devices >>>>>> using one of the 3 afor mentioned user names then the devices appear to >>>>>> sync. However -and this is the second and very serious problem- none of >>>>>> the 60 odd previously collected surveys have been uploaded to the backend >>>>>> at CommcareHQ whilst the orginally saved forms have now been removed from >>>>>> each of the devices with no apparent way to get them back. The only data >>>>>> we can find on CommcareHQ are the test surveys we did before and after this >>>>>> problem occurred. >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> User data on the mobile is sandboxed by account. So I wouldn't expect >>>>> that logging in as a different user and syncing would submit the other >>>>> user's forms. Have you tried logging back in as the original user and >>>>> seeing if the saved forms are there? I would not expect any data loss >>>>> unless you manually reinstalled the application, or cleared user data >>>>> intentionally. >>>>> >>>>> We need answers to the following questions urgently: >>>>>> >>>>>> 1. Is there a way for us to retrieve any of our 60-70 previously >>>>>> collected surveys from the devices now that they have apparently 'synced' >>>>>> with the cloud? >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> Hopefully, see above. >>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> 1. Is there a way for us to find any of the same 60-70 surveys on >>>>>> the cloud? >>>>>> >>>>>> If the forms never submitted they won't show up on HQ. >>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> 1. Is there a way to manually get survey data directly off the >>>>>> devices? (if this was possible we would not have any of these problems) >>>>>> >>>>>> There definitely should be - this seems to be the root problem. Are >>>>> you using multimedia/image capture in your forms? If so you may be >>>>> encountering a known bug that affects submissions, and we can suggest a >>>>> workaround. >>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> 1. Does the Commcare app save or create any backup of surveys on >>>>>> devices after it has been synced? >>>>>> >>>>>> After it has synced, no, however it should never delete anything >>>>> until the server successfully acknowledges that it receives it, and the >>>>> server should never lose anything. >>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> 1. How can we be sure that this system will work properly in the >>>>>> field when we deploy next time? (which will hopefully be very soon, or as >>>>>> soon as we have sorted this problem out) >>>>>> >>>>>> We need to get to the root cause of the submission issue, and then >>>>> (hopefully) everything should be fine. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> I have logged two reports about this already using the front end of >>>>>> the app on the devices (one send today and another one sent yesterday) >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> If my suggestions above don't work out please report an issue on HQ >>>>> and our team can continue investigating there. >>>>> >>>>> best, >>>>> Cory >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> I have been using Commcare for 3 years now and this is the first time >>>>>> I have ever seen anything like this and it is coursing our partners a lot >>>>>> of anxiety. >>>>>> >>>>>> Thanks, >>>>>> >>>>>> Douglas. >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>> Groups "commcare-users" group. >>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, >>>>>> send an email to commcare-user...@googlegroups.com. >>>>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "commcare-users" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to commcare-user...@googlegroups.com . >> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >> > >

Hey Douglas,

Once you follow those instructions and update the applications on the
phones all the forms and images should sync.

best,
Cory

··· On Wed, Jun 10, 2015 at 9:47 AM, Douglas Ian Scott < douglas.i.scott@gmail.com> wrote:

Hi Cory,

Thanks for that, very helpful. I do have one other question though. How
can I sync the existing 60 or so surveys that have photographs in them and
that are on the devices. Is there a way for me to alter saved forms that
allows me to ‘unanswer’ the photograph question or otherwise remove the
photograph so the bug does not kick in and thereby allow the forms to sync
with HQ?

Thanks,

Douglas.

On Wednesday, 10 June 2015 15:41:16 UTC+2, Cory Zue wrote:

Hey Douglas,

Cool, yeah it sounds like you’re experiencing a known issue with
multimedia submissions. You should be able to fix this by following the
same instructions here
https://groups.google.com/forum/#!searchin/commcare-users/secure$20submissions/commcare-users/WvNpcU1OhaU/hiIkgbrSePIJ
(pasted again).

  1. Go to your project settings --> Privacy and Security, and turn off the
    "secure submissions" setting.
  2. After changing this settings, create a new version of your application
    and deploy this version to your mobile device.

Note that disabling this setting does allow malicious users to fake data
submissions to your project. While this is likely a very low probability
scenario, it is worth noting. We are actively working on a fix so that this
workaround is no longer required.

Let us know if this doesn’t work, and we do expect to have this fixed
very shortly.

thanks,
Cory

On Wed, Jun 10, 2015 at 8:48 AM, Douglas Ian Scott douglas...@gmail.com wrote:

Hello,

I now think it is far more likely to have to do with the photographs.
When I do a survey without a photograph it syncs well. When I do the same
survey but with a photograph add to it then it will not sync.

Do you know if there is a fix for the photograph bug? Could you also
please tell me a bit more about this bug so we can work around it in the
future?

Thanks,

Douglas.

On Wednesday, 10 June 2015 14:34:04 UTC+2, Douglas Ian Scott wrote:

Hi Cory,

A quick question. If we want to upgrade from the Community program but
only want to have a short term contract of a couple of months do you know
who the best person at Dimagi might be to talk to about that. Also would
it be possible to move/share our existing project with a new CommcareHQ
administrator user?

Cheers,

Douglas.

On Wednesday, 10 June 2015 14:30:59 UTC+2, Douglas Ian Scott wrote:

Hi Cory,

Good to know that the survey data, in some way, stays on the device
even after syncing (or not syncing). In answer to your question about
photographs, yes the survey does indeed ask for participants to take a
photograph as part of the surveys.

Thanks for the quick response. We have found the ‘lost’ survey forms
following your suggestion that they are still stored on the devices within
the respective user name’s sandbox. Thanks for pointing this out.

However we still have the problem of some user login being able to
sync with the server and others not being able to sync with the survey. I
am using a Community plan which allows for 50 users and only have 14
registered in this project so I don’t think that should have anything to do
with it?

Cheers,

Douglas.

On Wednesday, 10 June 2015 13:08:46 UTC+2, Cory Zue wrote:

Hey Douglas,

Yikes! This sounds highly unexpected and hopefully everything is
still recoverable. I have a few quick questions/comments.

On Wed, Jun 10, 2015 at 6:52 AM, Douglas Ian Scott < douglas...@gmail.com> wrote:

Hello,

I have encountered a serious problem. We are currently running a
survey on businesses in Cape Town’s informal settlements with about 10
field workers and have run into the following problem (which we need
resolved in order for the survey users to maintain any degree of confidence
in the system) and that has led us to ask if the devices have any way of
backing up the fill out surveys?

We deployed 8 devices -each device being logged in to with one of 14
user names- in the field (using the “sustainablelivelihoods” project) where
they have collected about 60 to 70 detailed surveys so far over 2 days (8th
and 9th June 2015). We tested the system numerous times before it was sent
out into the field with it working perfectly.

Once in the field however no one was able to sync with the server to
save and upload completed surveys. They were able to login with no
problems but as soon as they tried to sync their devices Commcare refused
to upload completed surveys and gave no error message. The system seems to
work when I login using only the fime1, fime2, or fime3 user names but not
when using other more recently used ones. A small message in the top left
of the screen comes up saying it is syncing or uploading to the cloud but
this is not the case as the main sync button still indicates that all
surveys had not been synced. This is the first mysterious -but some what
less problematic- problem.

We found that if we logged out then logged in again into the devices
using one of the 3 afor mentioned user names then the devices appear to
sync. However -and this is the second and very serious problem- none of
the 60 odd previously collected surveys have been uploaded to the backend
at CommcareHQ whilst the orginally saved forms have now been removed from
each of the devices with no apparent way to get them back. The only data
we can find on CommcareHQ are the test surveys we did before and after this
problem occurred.

User data on the mobile is sandboxed by account. So I wouldn’t expect
that logging in as a different user and syncing would submit the other
user’s forms. Have you tried logging back in as the original user and
seeing if the saved forms are there? I would not expect any data loss
unless you manually reinstalled the application, or cleared user data
intentionally.

We need answers to the following questions urgently:

  1. Is there a way for us to retrieve any of our 60-70
    previously collected surveys from the devices now that they have apparently
    ’synced’ with the cloud?

Hopefully, see above.

  1. Is there a way for us to find any of the same 60-70 surveys
    on the cloud?

If the forms never submitted they won’t show up on HQ.

  1. Is there a way to manually get survey data directly off the
    devices? (if this was possible we would not have any of these problems)

There definitely should be - this seems to be the root problem. Are
you using multimedia/image capture in your forms? If so you may be
encountering a known bug that affects submissions, and we can suggest a
workaround.

  1. Does the Commcare app save or create any backup of surveys on
    devices after it has been synced?

After it has synced, no, however it should never delete anything
until the server successfully acknowledges that it receives it, and the
server should never lose anything.

  1. How can we be sure that this system will work properly in the
    field when we deploy next time? (which will hopefully be very soon, or as
    soon as we have sorted this problem out)

We need to get to the root cause of the submission issue, and then
(hopefully) everything should be fine.

I have logged two reports about this already using the front end of
the app on the devices (one send today and another one sent yesterday)

If my suggestions above don’t work out please report an issue on HQ
and our team can continue investigating there.

best,
Cory

I have been using Commcare for 3 years now and this is the first
time I have ever seen anything like this and it is coursing our partners a
lot of anxiety.

Thanks,

Douglas.


You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
Groups “commcare-users” group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it,
send an email to commcare-user...@googlegroups.com.
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You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
Groups “commcare-users” group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send
an email to commcare-user...@googlegroups.com.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.


You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
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Hi Cory,

Thanks for that. I have made the change and am trying to the Privicy and
Security settings on my project settings however I am having trouble making
a new version and deploying it. When I go to the New Version page it
simply tells me that I have made no new changes to justify a new version.
I am happy to make a superfical change but I am still worried about
deploying them on all the devices in a way that means it will auto update
so I dont have to clear the app’s data to load off from a blank version of
Commcare. I assume I can just push this new version so it will
automatically update on all the other devices?

··· On Wednesday, 10 June 2015 15:49:23 UTC+2, Cory Zue wrote: > > Hey Douglas, > > Once you follow those instructions and update the applications on the > phones all the forms and images should sync. > > best, > Cory > > On Wed, Jun 10, 2015 at 9:47 AM, Douglas Ian Scott <douglas...@gmail.com > wrote: > >> Hi Cory, >> >> Thanks for that, very helpful. I do have one other question though. How >> can I sync the existing 60 or so surveys that have photographs in them and >> that are on the devices. Is there a way for me to alter saved forms that >> allows me to 'unanswer' the photograph question or otherwise remove the >> photograph so the bug does not kick in and thereby allow the forms to sync >> with HQ? >> >> Thanks, >> >> Douglas. >> >> On Wednesday, 10 June 2015 15:41:16 UTC+2, Cory Zue wrote: >>> >>> Hey Douglas, >>> >>> Cool, yeah it sounds like you're experiencing a known issue with >>> multimedia submissions. You should be able to fix this by following the >>> same instructions here >>> >>> (pasted again). >>> >>> 1) Go to your project settings --> Privacy and Security, and turn off >>> the "secure submissions" setting. >>> 2) After changing this settings, create a new version of your >>> application and deploy this version to your mobile device. >>> >>> Note that disabling this setting does allow malicious users to fake data >>> submissions to your project. While this is likely a very low probability >>> scenario, it is worth noting. We are actively working on a fix so that this >>> workaround is no longer required. >>> >>> Let us know if this doesn't work, and we do expect to have this fixed >>> very shortly. >>> >>> thanks, >>> Cory >>> >>> On Wed, Jun 10, 2015 at 8:48 AM, Douglas Ian Scott >> >>>> Hello, >>>> >>>> I now think it is far more likely to have to do with the photographs. >>>> When I do a survey without a photograph it syncs well. When I do the same >>>> survey but with a photograph add to it then it will not sync. >>>> >>>> Do you know if there is a fix for the photograph bug? Could you also >>>> please tell me a bit more about this bug so we can work around it in the >>>> future? >>>> >>>> Thanks, >>>> >>>> Douglas. >>>> >>>> >>>> On Wednesday, 10 June 2015 14:34:04 UTC+2, Douglas Ian Scott wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Hi Cory, >>>>> >>>>> A quick question. If we want to upgrade from the Community program but >>>>> only want to have a short term contract of a couple of months do you know >>>>> who the best person at Dimagi might be to talk to about that. Also would >>>>> it be possible to move/share our existing project with a new CommcareHQ >>>>> administrator user? >>>>> >>>>> Cheers, >>>>> >>>>> Douglas. >>>>> >>>>> On Wednesday, 10 June 2015 14:30:59 UTC+2, Douglas Ian Scott wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> Hi Cory, >>>>>> >>>>>> Good to know that the survey data, in some way, stays on the device >>>>>> even after syncing (or not syncing). In answer to your question about >>>>>> photographs, yes the survey does indeed ask for participants to take a >>>>>> photograph as part of the surveys. >>>>>> >>>>>> Thanks for the quick response. We have found the 'lost' survey forms >>>>>> following your suggestion that they are still stored on the devices within >>>>>> the respective user name's sandbox. Thanks for pointing this out. >>>>>> >>>>>> However we still have the problem of some user login being able to >>>>>> sync with the server and others not being able to sync with the survey. I >>>>>> am using a Community plan which allows for 50 users and only have 14 >>>>>> registered in this project so I don't think that should have anything to do >>>>>> with it? >>>>>> >>>>>> Cheers, >>>>>> >>>>>> Douglas. >>>>>> >>>>>> On Wednesday, 10 June 2015 13:08:46 UTC+2, Cory Zue wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Hey Douglas, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Yikes! This sounds highly unexpected and hopefully everything is >>>>>>> still recoverable. I have a few quick questions/comments. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Wed, Jun 10, 2015 at 6:52 AM, Douglas Ian Scott < douglas...@gmail.com> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Hello, >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I have encountered a serious problem. We are currently running a >>>>>>>> survey on businesses in Cape Town's informal settlements with about 10 >>>>>>>> field workers and have run into the following problem (which we need >>>>>>>> resolved in order for the survey users to maintain any degree of confidence >>>>>>>> in the system) and that has led us to ask if the devices have any way of >>>>>>>> backing up the fill out surveys? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> We deployed 8 devices -each device being logged in to with one of >>>>>>>> 14 user names- in the field (using the "sustainablelivelihoods" project) >>>>>>>> where they have collected about 60 to 70 detailed surveys so far over 2 >>>>>>>> days (8th and 9th June 2015). We tested the system numerous times before >>>>>>>> it was sent out into the field with it working perfectly. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Once in the field however no one was able to sync with the server >>>>>>>> to save and upload completed surveys. They were able to login with no >>>>>>>> problems but as soon as they tried to sync their devices Commcare refused >>>>>>>> to upload completed surveys and gave no error message. The system seems to >>>>>>>> work when I login using only the fime1, fime2, or fime3 user names but not >>>>>>>> when using other more recently used ones. A small message in the top left >>>>>>>> of the screen comes up saying it is syncing or uploading to the cloud but >>>>>>>> this is not the case as the main sync button still indicates that all >>>>>>>> surveys had not been synced. This is the first mysterious -but some what >>>>>>>> less problematic- problem. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> We found that if we logged out then logged in again into the >>>>>>>> devices using one of the 3 afor mentioned user names then the devices >>>>>>>> appear to sync. However -and this is the second and very serious problem- >>>>>>>> none of the 60 odd previously collected surveys have been uploaded to the >>>>>>>> backend at CommcareHQ whilst the orginally saved forms have now been >>>>>>>> removed from each of the devices with no apparent way to get them back. >>>>>>>> The only data we can find on CommcareHQ are the test surveys we did before >>>>>>>> and after this problem occurred. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> User data on the mobile is sandboxed by account. So I wouldn't >>>>>>> expect that logging in as a different user and syncing would submit the >>>>>>> other user's forms. Have you tried logging back in as the original user and >>>>>>> seeing if the saved forms are there? I would not expect any data loss >>>>>>> unless you manually reinstalled the application, or cleared user data >>>>>>> intentionally. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> We need answers to the following questions urgently: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> 1. Is there a way for us to retrieve any of our 60-70 >>>>>>>> previously collected surveys from the devices now that they have apparently >>>>>>>> 'synced' with the cloud? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> Hopefully, see above. >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> 1. Is there a way for us to find any of the same 60-70 surveys >>>>>>>> on the cloud? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> If the forms never submitted they won't show up on HQ. >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> 1. Is there a way to manually get survey data directly off the >>>>>>>> devices? (if this was possible we would not have any of these problems) >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> There definitely should be - this seems to be the root problem. Are >>>>>>> you using multimedia/image capture in your forms? If so you may be >>>>>>> encountering a known bug that affects submissions, and we can suggest a >>>>>>> workaround. >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> 1. Does the Commcare app save or create any backup of surveys >>>>>>>> on devices after it has been synced? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> After it has synced, no, however it should never delete anything >>>>>>> until the server successfully acknowledges that it receives it, and the >>>>>>> server should never lose anything. >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> 1. How can we be sure that this system will work properly in >>>>>>>> the field when we deploy next time? (which will hopefully be very soon, or >>>>>>>> as soon as we have sorted this problem out) >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> We need to get to the root cause of the submission issue, and then >>>>>>> (hopefully) everything should be fine. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I have logged two reports about this already using the front end of >>>>>>>> the app on the devices (one send today and another one sent yesterday) >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> If my suggestions above don't work out please report an issue on HQ >>>>>>> and our team can continue investigating there. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> best, >>>>>>> Cory >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I have been using Commcare for 3 years now and this is the first >>>>>>>> time I have ever seen anything like this and it is coursing our partners a >>>>>>>> lot of anxiety. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Thanks, >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Douglas. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>>>> Groups "commcare-users" group. >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, >>>>>>>> send an email to commcare-user...@googlegroups.com. >>>>>>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -- >>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>> Groups "commcare-users" group. >>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>>> an email to commcare-user...@googlegroups.com. >>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>>> >>> >>> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "commcare-users" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to commcare-user...@googlegroups.com . >> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >> > >

As long as the last deployed version is what’s on the phones, making a
superfluous change and then making and starring a new build should allow
the “update commcare” button to pull the latest updates and everything
should be fine.

Updating the app will not clear any data.

··· On Wed, Jun 10, 2015 at 10:11 AM, Douglas Ian Scott < douglas.i.scott@gmail.com> wrote:

Hi Cory,

Thanks for that. I have made the change and am trying to the Privicy and
Security settings on my project settings however I am having trouble making
a new version and deploying it. When I go to the New Version page it
simply tells me that I have made no new changes to justify a new version.
I am happy to make a superfical change but I am still worried about
deploying them on all the devices in a way that means it will auto update
so I dont have to clear the app’s data to load off from a blank version of
Commcare. I assume I can just push this new version so it will
automatically update on all the other devices?

On Wednesday, 10 June 2015 15:49:23 UTC+2, Cory Zue wrote:

Hey Douglas,

Once you follow those instructions and update the applications on the
phones all the forms and images should sync.

best,
Cory

On Wed, Jun 10, 2015 at 9:47 AM, Douglas Ian Scott douglas...@gmail.com wrote:

Hi Cory,

Thanks for that, very helpful. I do have one other question though.
How can I sync the existing 60 or so surveys that have photographs in them
and that are on the devices. Is there a way for me to alter saved forms
that allows me to ‘unanswer’ the photograph question or otherwise remove
the photograph so the bug does not kick in and thereby allow the forms to
sync with HQ?

Thanks,

Douglas.

On Wednesday, 10 June 2015 15:41:16 UTC+2, Cory Zue wrote:

Hey Douglas,

Cool, yeah it sounds like you’re experiencing a known issue with
multimedia submissions. You should be able to fix this by following the
same instructions here
https://groups.google.com/forum/#!searchin/commcare-users/secure$20submissions/commcare-users/WvNpcU1OhaU/hiIkgbrSePIJ
(pasted again).

  1. Go to your project settings --> Privacy and Security, and turn off
    the “secure submissions” setting.
  2. After changing this settings, create a new version of your
    application and deploy this version to your mobile device.

Note that disabling this setting does allow malicious users to fake
data submissions to your project. While this is likely a very low
probability scenario, it is worth noting. We are actively working on a fix
so that this workaround is no longer required.

Let us know if this doesn’t work, and we do expect to have this fixed
very shortly.

thanks,
Cory

On Wed, Jun 10, 2015 at 8:48 AM, Douglas Ian Scott < douglas...@gmail.com> wrote:

Hello,

I now think it is far more likely to have to do with the photographs.
When I do a survey without a photograph it syncs well. When I do the same
survey but with a photograph add to it then it will not sync.

Do you know if there is a fix for the photograph bug? Could you also
please tell me a bit more about this bug so we can work around it in the
future?

Thanks,

Douglas.

On Wednesday, 10 June 2015 14:34:04 UTC+2, Douglas Ian Scott wrote:

Hi Cory,

A quick question. If we want to upgrade from the Community program
but only want to have a short term contract of a couple of months do you
know who the best person at Dimagi might be to talk to about that. Also
would it be possible to move/share our existing project with a new
CommcareHQ administrator user?

Cheers,

Douglas.

On Wednesday, 10 June 2015 14:30:59 UTC+2, Douglas Ian Scott wrote:

Hi Cory,

Good to know that the survey data, in some way, stays on the device
even after syncing (or not syncing). In answer to your question about
photographs, yes the survey does indeed ask for participants to take a
photograph as part of the surveys.

Thanks for the quick response. We have found the ‘lost’ survey
forms following your suggestion that they are still stored on the devices
within the respective user name’s sandbox. Thanks for pointing this out.

However we still have the problem of some user login being able to
sync with the server and others not being able to sync with the survey. I
am using a Community plan which allows for 50 users and only have 14
registered in this project so I don’t think that should have anything to do
with it?

Cheers,

Douglas.

On Wednesday, 10 June 2015 13:08:46 UTC+2, Cory Zue wrote:

Hey Douglas,

Yikes! This sounds highly unexpected and hopefully everything is
still recoverable. I have a few quick questions/comments.

On Wed, Jun 10, 2015 at 6:52 AM, Douglas Ian Scott < douglas...@gmail.com> wrote:

Hello,

I have encountered a serious problem. We are currently running a
survey on businesses in Cape Town’s informal settlements with about 10
field workers and have run into the following problem (which we need
resolved in order for the survey users to maintain any degree of confidence
in the system) and that has led us to ask if the devices have any way of
backing up the fill out surveys?

We deployed 8 devices -each device being logged in to with one of
14 user names- in the field (using the “sustainablelivelihoods” project)
where they have collected about 60 to 70 detailed surveys so far over 2
days (8th and 9th June 2015). We tested the system numerous times before
it was sent out into the field with it working perfectly.

Once in the field however no one was able to sync with the server
to save and upload completed surveys. They were able to login with no
problems but as soon as they tried to sync their devices Commcare refused
to upload completed surveys and gave no error message. The system seems to
work when I login using only the fime1, fime2, or fime3 user names but not
when using other more recently used ones. A small message in the top left
of the screen comes up saying it is syncing or uploading to the cloud but
this is not the case as the main sync button still indicates that all
surveys had not been synced. This is the first mysterious -but some what
less problematic- problem.

We found that if we logged out then logged in again into the
devices using one of the 3 afor mentioned user names then the devices
appear to sync. However -and this is the second and very serious problem-
none of the 60 odd previously collected surveys have been uploaded to the
backend at CommcareHQ whilst the orginally saved forms have now been
removed from each of the devices with no apparent way to get them back.
The only data we can find on CommcareHQ are the test surveys we did before
and after this problem occurred.

User data on the mobile is sandboxed by account. So I wouldn’t
expect that logging in as a different user and syncing would submit the
other user’s forms. Have you tried logging back in as the original user and
seeing if the saved forms are there? I would not expect any data loss
unless you manually reinstalled the application, or cleared user data
intentionally.

We need answers to the following questions urgently:

  1. Is there a way for us to retrieve any of our 60-70
    previously collected surveys from the devices now that they have apparently
    ’synced’ with the cloud?

Hopefully, see above.

  1. Is there a way for us to find any of the same 60-70 surveys
    on the cloud?

If the forms never submitted they won’t show up on HQ.

  1. Is there a way to manually get survey data directly off the
    devices? (if this was possible we would not have any of these problems)

There definitely should be - this seems to be the root problem.
Are you using multimedia/image capture in your forms? If so you may be
encountering a known bug that affects submissions, and we can suggest a
workaround.

  1. Does the Commcare app save or create any backup of surveys
    on devices after it has been synced?

After it has synced, no, however it should never delete anything
until the server successfully acknowledges that it receives it, and the
server should never lose anything.

  1. How can we be sure that this system will work properly in
    the field when we deploy next time? (which will hopefully be very soon, or
    as soon as we have sorted this problem out)

We need to get to the root cause of the submission issue, and then
(hopefully) everything should be fine.

I have logged two reports about this already using the front end
of the app on the devices (one send today and another one sent yesterday)

If my suggestions above don’t work out please report an issue on HQ
and our team can continue investigating there.

best,
Cory

I have been using Commcare for 3 years now and this is the first
time I have ever seen anything like this and it is coursing our partners a
lot of anxiety.

Thanks,

Douglas.


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Thanks Cory, seems to be working well now.

··· On Wednesday, 10 June 2015 16:17:38 UTC+2, Cory Zue wrote: > > As long as the last deployed version is what's on the phones, making a > superfluous change and then making and starring a new build should allow > the "update commcare" button to pull the latest updates and everything > should be fine. > > Updating the app will not clear any data. > > On Wed, Jun 10, 2015 at 10:11 AM, Douglas Ian Scott <douglas...@gmail.com > wrote: > >> Hi Cory, >> >> Thanks for that. I have made the change and am trying to the Privicy and >> Security settings on my project settings however I am having trouble making >> a new version and deploying it. When I go to the New Version page it >> simply tells me that I have made no new changes to justify a new version. >> I am happy to make a superfical change but I am still worried about >> deploying them on all the devices in a way that means it will auto update >> so I dont have to clear the app's data to load off from a blank version of >> Commcare. I assume I can just push this new version so it will >> automatically update on all the other devices? >> >> On Wednesday, 10 June 2015 15:49:23 UTC+2, Cory Zue wrote: >>> >>> Hey Douglas, >>> >>> Once you follow those instructions and update the applications on the >>> phones all the forms and images should sync. >>> >>> best, >>> Cory >>> >>> On Wed, Jun 10, 2015 at 9:47 AM, Douglas Ian Scott >> >>>> Hi Cory, >>>> >>>> Thanks for that, very helpful. I do have one other question though. >>>> How can I sync the existing 60 or so surveys that have photographs in them >>>> and that are on the devices. Is there a way for me to alter saved forms >>>> that allows me to 'unanswer' the photograph question or otherwise remove >>>> the photograph so the bug does not kick in and thereby allow the forms to >>>> sync with HQ? >>>> >>>> Thanks, >>>> >>>> Douglas. >>>> >>>> On Wednesday, 10 June 2015 15:41:16 UTC+2, Cory Zue wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Hey Douglas, >>>>> >>>>> Cool, yeah it sounds like you're experiencing a known issue with >>>>> multimedia submissions. You should be able to fix this by following the >>>>> same instructions here >>>>> >>>>> (pasted again). >>>>> >>>>> 1) Go to your project settings --> Privacy and Security, and turn off >>>>> the "secure submissions" setting. >>>>> 2) After changing this settings, create a new version of your >>>>> application and deploy this version to your mobile device. >>>>> >>>>> Note that disabling this setting does allow malicious users to fake >>>>> data submissions to your project. While this is likely a very low >>>>> probability scenario, it is worth noting. We are actively working on a fix >>>>> so that this workaround is no longer required. >>>>> >>>>> Let us know if this doesn't work, and we do expect to have this fixed >>>>> very shortly. >>>>> >>>>> thanks, >>>>> Cory >>>>> >>>>> On Wed, Jun 10, 2015 at 8:48 AM, Douglas Ian Scott < douglas...@gmail.com> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Hello, >>>>>> >>>>>> I now think it is far more likely to have to do with the >>>>>> photographs. When I do a survey without a photograph it syncs well. When >>>>>> I do the same survey but with a photograph add to it then it will not sync. >>>>>> >>>>>> Do you know if there is a fix for the photograph bug? Could you also >>>>>> please tell me a bit more about this bug so we can work around it in the >>>>>> future? >>>>>> >>>>>> Thanks, >>>>>> >>>>>> Douglas. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> On Wednesday, 10 June 2015 14:34:04 UTC+2, Douglas Ian Scott wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Hi Cory, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> A quick question. If we want to upgrade from the Community program >>>>>>> but only want to have a short term contract of a couple of months do you >>>>>>> know who the best person at Dimagi might be to talk to about that. Also >>>>>>> would it be possible to move/share our existing project with a new >>>>>>> CommcareHQ administrator user? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Cheers, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Douglas. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Wednesday, 10 June 2015 14:30:59 UTC+2, Douglas Ian Scott wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Hi Cory, >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Good to know that the survey data, in some way, stays on the device >>>>>>>> even after syncing (or not syncing). In answer to your question about >>>>>>>> photographs, yes the survey does indeed ask for participants to take a >>>>>>>> photograph as part of the surveys. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Thanks for the quick response. We have found the 'lost' survey >>>>>>>> forms following your suggestion that they are still stored on the devices >>>>>>>> within the respective user name's sandbox. Thanks for pointing this out. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> However we still have the problem of some user login being able to >>>>>>>> sync with the server and others not being able to sync with the survey. I >>>>>>>> am using a Community plan which allows for 50 users and only have 14 >>>>>>>> registered in this project so I don't think that should have anything to do >>>>>>>> with it? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Cheers, >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Douglas. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Wednesday, 10 June 2015 13:08:46 UTC+2, Cory Zue wrote: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Hey Douglas, >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Yikes! This sounds highly unexpected and hopefully everything is >>>>>>>>> still recoverable. I have a few quick questions/comments. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On Wed, Jun 10, 2015 at 6:52 AM, Douglas Ian Scott < douglas...@gmail.com> wrote: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Hello, >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> I have encountered a serious problem. We are currently running a >>>>>>>>>> survey on businesses in Cape Town's informal settlements with about 10 >>>>>>>>>> field workers and have run into the following problem (which we need >>>>>>>>>> resolved in order for the survey users to maintain any degree of confidence >>>>>>>>>> in the system) and that has led us to ask if the devices have any way of >>>>>>>>>> backing up the fill out surveys? >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> We deployed 8 devices -each device being logged in to with one of >>>>>>>>>> 14 user names- in the field (using the "sustainablelivelihoods" project) >>>>>>>>>> where they have collected about 60 to 70 detailed surveys so far over 2 >>>>>>>>>> days (8th and 9th June 2015). We tested the system numerous times before >>>>>>>>>> it was sent out into the field with it working perfectly. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Once in the field however no one was able to sync with the server >>>>>>>>>> to save and upload completed surveys. They were able to login with no >>>>>>>>>> problems but as soon as they tried to sync their devices Commcare refused >>>>>>>>>> to upload completed surveys and gave no error message. The system seems to >>>>>>>>>> work when I login using only the fime1, fime2, or fime3 user names but not >>>>>>>>>> when using other more recently used ones. A small message in the top left >>>>>>>>>> of the screen comes up saying it is syncing or uploading to the cloud but >>>>>>>>>> this is not the case as the main sync button still indicates that all >>>>>>>>>> surveys had not been synced. This is the first mysterious -but some what >>>>>>>>>> less problematic- problem. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> We found that if we logged out then logged in again into the >>>>>>>>>> devices using one of the 3 afor mentioned user names then the devices >>>>>>>>>> appear to sync. However -and this is the second and very serious problem- >>>>>>>>>> none of the 60 odd previously collected surveys have been uploaded to the >>>>>>>>>> backend at CommcareHQ whilst the orginally saved forms have now been >>>>>>>>>> removed from each of the devices with no apparent way to get them back. >>>>>>>>>> The only data we can find on CommcareHQ are the test surveys we did before >>>>>>>>>> and after this problem occurred. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> User data on the mobile is sandboxed by account. So I wouldn't >>>>>>>>> expect that logging in as a different user and syncing would submit the >>>>>>>>> other user's forms. Have you tried logging back in as the original user and >>>>>>>>> seeing if the saved forms are there? I would not expect any data loss >>>>>>>>> unless you manually reinstalled the application, or cleared user data >>>>>>>>> intentionally. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> We need answers to the following questions urgently: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> 1. Is there a way for us to retrieve any of our 60-70 >>>>>>>>>> previously collected surveys from the devices now that they have apparently >>>>>>>>>> 'synced' with the cloud? >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Hopefully, see above. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> 1. Is there a way for us to find any of the same 60-70 >>>>>>>>>> surveys on the cloud? >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> If the forms never submitted they won't show up on HQ. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> 1. Is there a way to manually get survey data directly off >>>>>>>>>> the devices? (if this was possible we would not have any of these problems) >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> There definitely should be - this seems to be the root problem. >>>>>>>>> Are you using multimedia/image capture in your forms? If so you may be >>>>>>>>> encountering a known bug that affects submissions, and we can suggest a >>>>>>>>> workaround. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> 1. Does the Commcare app save or create any backup of surveys >>>>>>>>>> on devices after it has been synced? >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> After it has synced, no, however it should never delete anything >>>>>>>>> until the server successfully acknowledges that it receives it, and the >>>>>>>>> server should never lose anything. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> 1. How can we be sure that this system will work properly in >>>>>>>>>> the field when we deploy next time? (which will hopefully be very soon, or >>>>>>>>>> as soon as we have sorted this problem out) >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> We need to get to the root cause of the submission issue, and >>>>>>>>> then (hopefully) everything should be fine. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> I have logged two reports about this already using the front end >>>>>>>>>> of the app on the devices (one send today and another one sent yesterday) >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> If my suggestions above don't work out please report an issue on >>>>>>>>> HQ and our team can continue investigating there. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> best, >>>>>>>>> Cory >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> I have been using Commcare for 3 years now and this is the first >>>>>>>>>> time I have ever seen anything like this and it is coursing our partners a >>>>>>>>>> lot of anxiety. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Thanks, >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Douglas. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the >>>>>>>>>> Google Groups "commcare-users" group. >>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, >>>>>>>>>> send an email to commcare-user...@googlegroups.com. >>>>>>>>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>> Groups "commcare-users" group. >>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, >>>>>> send an email to commcare-user...@googlegroups.com. >>>>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>> Groups "commcare-users" group. >>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>>> an email to commcare-user...@googlegroups.com. >>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>>> >>> >>> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "commcare-users" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to commcare-user...@googlegroups.com . >> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >> > >